[Typo3-doc] How to get started? Analyses of the steep learning curve

[Peter Niederlag]

Hi Peter,

Peter Kindström schrieb:
> Hi JoH and Peter,
> 
>>>A new "Getting started" should follow the KISS principle which means: You
>>>should focus on the basics and leave complex things like TV to the "Advanced
>>>TYPO3 concepts" tutorial.
> 
> 
> I think you missed one big point: TV is not complex to use
> compared to TypoScript!

LOL. Yes, you can get started by clicking. But there is no chance you
get the desired, professional results without knowing:
* Typoscript
* T3DataStructures (which is kind of all TYPO3 basic KnowHow mixed in
one place)

Yes, you can start and get *some* result. Chances are about 99,9%
percent the user wants to change something.

And now? Then he will have *very much* to learn with TV.

> But I guess when you already know TypoScript (like you two?),
> then TV is not as good as TS. And technically I guess TV is more
> complex, but the user does not have to know that (and that´s the
> point I guess).

If you want to control the output (which almost all users do), then
there is *no way* other than *understanding the concept* of Typoscript.
TV afaik still uses Typoscript for rendering, doesn't it?
Can you already click TS-menu-Objects?

>>Starting with TV without GoLive-Tut or MTB knowledge is like buliding a
>>plane without having ever glued two pieces of paper together.
> 
> 
> Ooops, I guess my exitsing website does not work then? :-)

Well, it probably crashes tomorrow. ;)

> Of course you need MTB right now, because FTB rely on that. But
> I have never read the GoLive Tutorial and just a minute ago my
> website worked just great (as it have done the last year...).

"I would like my headers to show '<img src="fo" /><h2
class="myWeirdfunnyClass">Text entered</h2>' How can I do that?"

You know how to solve that? Right? And you must have somehow putten in
am menu.

That needs to be taught first imho. Then all fancy stuff that one can use.

Maybe it's an Option to offer two tracks:

* You want full control over your website and understand what's going
on? Start by learning the basics about Typoscript and setup a simple
website in 30 Minutes.

* You want to create Website by a Click and Drop GUI-Interface in three
minutes? Go the TV way

> So please, don´t assume everybody else must do things the way
> you always have done! People are different and things change!

Sure, even differnet people and projects need different approches.
I remember for sure how I was struggling some years ago...

>>That's my experince from guiding a lot of beginners in workshops and
>>projects. The autoparser is a nice thing, but only needed if you
>>constantly get HTML brought in by somebody who you are not willing to
>>teach the very simple principle of a CMS, that some ### will get
>>replaced dynamically.
> 
> 
> Hmmmm, have you ever tried to teach some beginners TV instead?
> So you have something to compare with?

Yes I have had some users that installed TYPO3, started doing projects
with TV, causing very much trouble because they didn't have any idea
what was going on. ;)

Peter
-- 
Peter Niederlag
http://www.niekom.de * TYPO3 & EDV Dienstleistungen *
http://www.typo3partner.net * professional services network *