[Typo3] TYPO3 on Windows - how is it working?

Tue Mar 8 11:45:15 CET 2005

Michael Stucki wrote:
> Hi folks,
> 
> (I'm aware that I'll might start a flamewar with this. Please stick to the
> facts when writing anny comments!)
> 
> I am very interested about some feedbacks of TYPO3 running on Windows
> servers.

First off, let me say thanks for still supporting the windows platform. I realize Linux is a better 
platform for hosting but, some of us do not have time to learn another OS on top of all the other 
things in life.

Secondly, this is a long post.
> 
> Why are you using it? Was this your decision or was this requested by
> someone else (boss, customer)?

See above.

I use windows because I came from an animation, design background. I knew how to tune it, win 2000 
pro, to get great performance and I could work on most every config in a windowed environment. I use 
it as a development platform and to learn typo3. I started with typo3 around version 3.2 and finally 
made a real site recently that for me was a semi-complex one. It runs now on 3.6.2

1)  It uses templavoila exclusively because as a designer and non programmer it is easier to understand.

2)  It also uses php scripts outside typo3 to personalize the site specific to user location. These 
scripts call text files that are symlinked to files inside fileadmin that the BE users can update. I 
realized I could have programmed the same functionality inside of typo3 but, I did not know how at 
the time. Now it is already done.

3) It uses several extensions. Some are:

ao_vehicles
page_php_content
pk_save_form_mail
rlmp_flash detection

4) The client and customer were already doing business using windows and wanted to keep everything 
in the same environment and machine.

5) the site is http://www.bestleaseusa.com
       http://www.bestleaseusa.com/index.php?id=34 (to skip the flash intro)

6) A static file url manipulator was not used as the client paid google for placement and initially 
the site was to run on windows where the static file extension was not working properly at the time.

> 
> Where are you using it? Do you use the Windows server only for testing
> purposes or do you also use it for production?

I created all the graphics and layout on win2000 pro using photoshop, dreamweaver, flash, 
illustrator, editing scripts in edit plus.

We were going to run a production server using IIS 5.0, or 6.0 and set everything up to run that 
way. Due to the hosting server having too many sites on it, the site was moved to a local U.S. 
hosting provider using Linux.

I initially installed apache 1.3.x  MySql, and PHP separately as I do not have IIS running on my 
machine and at the time there were many issues with typo3 on IIS. Like whenever there was a config 
error the response would be "just use apache."

I installed to a drive other than c:\ as I only like to keep my OS on c:\. I installed to e: in my 
current setup. Everything works including IM 4.2.9, or  5.x.x ( I had to look at Big Apache and 
modify some scripts to get ai and pdf working.)

I later used ingmars installer to install to the E:\ drive. using apache 2.0.x for typo3 version 3.6.2.

One thing different from linux is that the utility programs that are included with linux are not 
provided with windows. Programmers and sys admins know this. Newbie, designers, and your average 
windows user do not. For example; ImageMagick, ghostscript and gui interface, HTML doc, diff, some 
form of MySql administrator, some form of symlink program, tidy, a cvs program. This presents 
problems when a new user tries to run typo3 out of the box and a call to one of the supporting 
programs is used. Also all windows programs either want to be installed to "program files" or on 
drive "C:\".

Once the site was created locally I stopped the apache and MySql services and through explorer 
copied the data directly from the fileadmin and mysql data folder onto the host machine. This 
allowed me to have an exact copy of the local database. I then cleared cache and optimized tables 
through phpMyAdmin and had an exact copy of the database on the server. I needed this as I was 
calling specific PID's using page_php_content to have flash movies link to their next page. (Yes 
Robert I could offer a few suggestions on improving your flash extension but, alas I know you are 
way busy.)

The extensions for backing up typo3 inside the CMS did not work on windows. My system, though not 
elegant, worked flawlessly. Now I use MySql Administrator to create a backup on the local machine 
and a restore on the server. This works cross platform. Exporting a page tree from within typo3 
never created the same PID structure.

I use this system to try different things without needing to upload or work online all the time.

personal rant=on
It is getting harder to use windows for development as Kasper is no longer using windows for any 
development work (as far as I know.) This means that although 80% of the people browsing use 
windows,  there is no active development on the platform to test for bugs by the main developer. I 
see that as a problem.
personal rant=off

> 
> What webserver are you using? IIS, Apache, ...? Did you compare between
> those server components?
> 
We initially tried to run IIS 5.0 but kept having issues with slow downs. We then installed Apache 
alongside IIS and called the flash intro from IIS and the main typo3 website from apache using a 
different port. Once we moved the site to a typo3 ISP, I created a shortcut to the flash intro and 
everything runs inside typo3.

> And finally, how is it working? Are you happy with that server environment,
> would you recommend it, or did you give up in order to switch to a Unix
> system?

I would recommend using linux as a server due to its speed and that typo3 is developed solely on 
linux now.

I would recommend using windows as a development system with a few "very strict" criteria.

First of all if you are going to support it you are going to have to document it. There are people 
with sys admin experience that have a true understanding of how to correctly set up the server. I 
kludged a working system together because I had time to learn and wanted to gain an understanding of 
what was going on.

OSes with volumes formatted with NTFS 5.0 or higher. NTFS 5.0 is supported in Windows 2000, Windows 
XP, Windows 2003 and higher.

I do not think anything less than win 2000 should be used. no win95, win98. The system needs to be 
pro business level, not home level. The reason for this is that symlinks can be used on windows, if 
the correct operating system is used, and should be. There are numerous programs that can create 
symlinks similar to linux to create an install as similar to the linux install as possible.

Junction points, or reparse points(windows version of symlinks) can only be created on volumes 
formatted with NTFS 5.0 or higher. NTFS 5.0 is supported in Windows 2000, Windows XP, Windows 2003 
and higher. Which is why only these OSes should be used for typo3.

LINKS
http://www.sysinternals.com/ "junction" ---console based symlink program with typo3 batch file by 
Patrick ? (no lastname)
http://www.pearlmagik.com/ "winbolic" ---gui based symlink program this will work across drives.
http://www.rekenwonder.com/ "junction link magic" ---gui based system running on top of junction 
link by mike nordel
http://www.hlm.inc.ru/  "hard link magic" --- a file link vs. symlink program

I think there needs to be an installer that either checks for support programs or includes them.
These include but, are not limited to, diff, IM, ghostscript and ghostgum, some symlink program or a 
link to it, htmlDoc, tidy, MySql Admin. Personally I would like to see them installed into a folder 
called "tools" or "utils" with subfolders listing each specific program.

So my folder structure is:
install to any drive (yes it can be done)

apps
   photoshop
   dreamweaver
   illustrator

typo3 (main folder)
     apache
     htdocs
     IM
     MySql
     PHP
     Perl
     tools
       diff
       mySql Administrator
       mmcache
       HTMLdoc
       phpmyadmin
       symlink program (choose one)
       scripts
       tortiseCVS
       zend
       webdav
     source (or TYPO3core)
       3.6.0
       3.7.0
       3.8.0
     tmp
       mmcache

I would not create an installer that leaves the root UID and password for MySql blank. Using MySql 
Administrator can create a password and UID if needed. If the user has to have a password to get 
into the BE and the installer they can use one for MySql. Because you know some people will use the 
installer for a production system at some point.

If installing under IIS the issues about IM and cmd.exe need to be addressed or noted. Under IIS 
fast-cgi or other PHP version needs to be addressed and what needs to be configured should be noted.

I used the information on http://www.devside.net/ to learn about installing and setting up an Apache 
web server. The tutorials are very well documented and you wind up with a relatively secure server.

As far as log files go there are ways to both log, rotate and delete old files. I use Analog for 
logging, Report magic for a nice visual format and there are addons to report magic that will allow 
the rotation and "deletion" of log files for IIS on windows.

This is cross platform.
http://www.analog.cx/
http://www.reportmagic.org/index.html
http://www.reportmagic.org/addons.html

For cron jobs there are a few possibilities:
http://cronw.sourceforge.net/
http://www.visualcron.com/
http://www.nncron.ru/index.shtml
http://www.advsyscon.com/products/activebatch/activebatch.asp?mode=whatsnew
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=87160&package_id=106736

http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/downloads/list/webdev.asp

Windows Script Host is the successor of batch files and enables scripts to be executed directly on 
the Windows desktop or command console, without the need to embed those scripts in an HTML document. 
Scripts can be run directly from the desktop by clicking on a script file, or from the command 
console. WSH provides a low-memory scripting host that is ideal for non-interactive scripting needs, 
such as logon scripting, administrative scripting, and so on.

Here is a tutorial.
http://www.iopus.com/guides/winscheduler.htm

sorry about not adding this to the wiki page but, you may want to verify some of this first. Feel 
free to ask me any questions. Sorry for the length.

wes currier

> 
> Maybe have a look at the newly set up Wiki page and feel free to extend it
> with useful details:
> http://wiki.typo3.org/index.php/Operating_System
> 
> Thanks for your comments!
> 
> Regards, michael
> 
> (Crosspost typo3.english and typo3.install.windows. Please reply to
> typo3.english only!)