[TYPO3-hci] The Constant Triptichon

[Quentin Dewhurst]

It seems to me that we have 3 people thinking that the backend representing 
the front end visually in some manner is a good idea - and one person (all 
due respect) obviously in disagreement, but the fact that its clearly of 
interest to some should not be overlooked.

In my opinion having the backend represent the layout of the front end 
templates provides the user with (forgive the use of HCI terminology) a good 
'Mental Model' of the system that they are already currently familiar with 
(eg their website) and this in itself should dramatically reduce the need 
for any documentation because it would become clearly apparant in the 
backend where they should be entering their data in order for it to appear 
on their site by providing excellent visual clues.   This is the main reason 
for me agreeing to phillips suggestion in the first place - and its 
something that has been playing on my mind since first using typo3 (back in 
the days of version 3.5).

Anyhow - I do hope this idea isnt brushed under the carpet because I would 
consider it a huge benifit to Typo3 and its community.

Regards, Q



> Christopher wrote:
>> Alex Heizer wrote:
>>
>>> Christopher wrote:
>>>
>>>> Alex Heizer wrote:
>>>>
>>
>> <big snip>
>>
>>
>>>> 1. A TSconfig option for switching to/from the standard 'column'
>>>> layout, and/or,
>>>>
>>>> 2. A checkbox (or other form control) that switches between standard
>>>> and FE-like views (provided a FE-like view is available) in the Page
>>>> module.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> You can already do these things in the BE (even if it's not very well
>>> documented). Don't forget about Web->View for viewing the FE in the BE.
>>> The good thing about T3 is that it can do so much. My point is, since an
>>> individual can already customize their own installs the way you suggest,
>>> what would the benefit be to forcing this behavior on everyone in place
>>> of a BE that already has worked for years which allows thousands of
>>> existing editors to use existing documentation for? Since, in my
>>> experience the current BE is the preferred interface just the way it is,
>>> forcing a different BE on these users would be a step backwards as far
>>> as usability (they would choose the FE if they wanted it).
>>>
>>
>> Well I have not been trying to suggest that the BE should really be LIKE
>> the FE as such, only that there is definite value in a visual
>> resemblance between the 'columns' area and the FE. Unless I'm much
>> mistaken, this is /not/ possible at the moment--you can only re-label
>> existing columns and add new ones.
>>
>> Further, who said anything about 'forcing' anything? As for any other
>> customizable part of a UI, we need reasonable defaults. I see nothing
>> wrong with continuing with the existing mode in this respect.
>>
>> Regarding documentation, I rather suspect that you're underestimating
>> your users.
>> As I mentioned, a secret code is no secret if you provide
>> the key to the reader--in other words, a BE-ordered layout in the Page
>> module is unlikely to be confusing to /anyone/ if users have been told
>> that the order of items reflects what they see in the FE of the site.
>>
> We're probably not going to agree on this point either. I suspect that
> you're overestimating your users and asking them to work to understand
> and intuit how to use the system based on concepts. For the end users it
> should be a clear 1-2-3-you're-done process for editing. Guessing how to
> use the system by reading newsgroups and searching Google and outdated
> manuals is one thing for developers who need the site to do one of a
> hundred different things. Knowing how and where to add a block of text
> should be a no-brainer for editors since the original purpose of TYPO3
> is to make it a no-brainer for editors to manage their content. When an
> editor opens the BE and their 1-2-3-you're-done documentation deviates
> from what they see on the screen, they get confused and call for help.
> This is especially true when editors have only basic computer skills and
> edit their site once a week or even less frequently.
>
> The point is, any deviation of icon and menu item locations from the
> documentation is bad for usability, especially once the editors take
> over since many of them can have only basic computer skills. If the
> documentation doesn't clearly show the location of an item, for them the
> item doesn't exist and we can't expect them to go hunting for it. This
> will be increasingly important the more TYPO3 is adopted and less
> technical people use it, and no enterprise software asks its end users
> to hunt for its basic features.
>
> Alex
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