[Neos] Neos and bootstrap css

Rens Admiraal rens.admiraal at typo3.org
Sun Nov 24 18:24:04 CET 2013

Hey Simon,

First of all thanks for your feedback. We need this feedback, and we use 
the feedback we get.

I do read some stuff in your email which I would like to correct though. 
We've seen your change, and we've looked at it. We've discussed it, and 
I've even worked multiple hours to get your module working on Neos 
master (although that work stopped as I had to do more pressing stuff 
during that codesprint). So don't have the feeling we ignore the change, 
we just came to the conclusion that the change fixes an issue that is 
not really there. I tried to explain it on IRC today, and will try again 
in this reply. I will mostly do this from a technical perspective though.

When we started using bootstrap long time ago we did this because it was 
thought to be a boost for development speed. We never intended to make 
it an api for Neos though, as we knew on forehand that it wouldn't 
fulfill all requirements we have in Neos. We need a lot of components 
bootstrap just doesn't offer, and some of the components we don't need 
at all.

This is why the current components and css of Neos have a lot of 
similarity, but: the CSS and JS in Neos is *NOT* bootstrap. This would 
also be impossible, as we load our CSS in the same scope as the frontend 
website, which would effectively mean that websites with bootstrap would 
only be possible if the exact same version of Bootstrap was used in the 
frontend and backend. This is why we decided to put effort in the neos-* 
prefix before the 1.0 release when Bootstrap 3 was released, which 
effectively broke Neos.

Regarding your module I hope you know that you use backend modules in 
Neos which are currently not yet api / documented. This means that it 
could, should and will work, but that you can expect some stuff to 
change later on. And especially in the backend modules I expect some 
changes to happen. Please keep this in mind ;-)

I hope we can find a way to get your module working when you include 
your own bootstrap. This should work, as we tried to get even the 
bootstrap components to be really isolated into our own javascript 
scope. If this for some reason does not work, we have an issue. But to 
really conclude that this is the case I should have a look at the code 
which is troublesome at the moment because of the limited time we have.

A short summary of above:

* We strive to having a good integrator experience (the UX part) when 
integrating backend modules, for which we will offer an api in later 
versions of Neos.
* We do not aim for having all bootstrap components styled and working 
in Neos (would you like to even use this if only 30% of the components 
would be styled?)
* We are willing to help to get it working, but if you want to have a 
stable css / bootstrap experience in your own module, you will have to 
include it yourself for now. Maybe later on the api of Neos can fit your 

Will I see the bootstrap issue if I install your package in current 
master of Neos? Let's try to find some time this week to at least define 
the exact details regarding this 'bug' so we can fix it as soon as 
possible (although this could mean this can only happen after the 1.0 
release). But maybe just some guideance would be enough for optimizing 
your patchset.

Looking forward to get this working, as I think your package is has a 
good usecase ;-)


Simon Schaufelberger schreef op 11/24/13 16:52 :
> Hi!
> This message is mainly for the UX team (Rasmus).
> People always shout for feedback which I'm giving you today.
> I have followed whats going on with the css in neos for a long time now.
> First there was bootstrap as base and then "the big rewrite" with
> "neos-" prefixes.
> The "problem" is that some bootsrap code was and is not working even
> after rewriting with the new prefixes and some other small changes.
> I am currently developing a backend module and i want to use very simple
> dropdown menus
> (http://getbootstrap.com/2.3.2/components.html#buttonDropdowns). The
> user menu on the top right corner is working BUT in the actual module it
> is NOT working. Why? Because the neos team actually broke some parts of
> bootstrap.
> In my case, the dropdown menu is showing up (see screenshots in the
> ticket below) with a button to click and a dropdown menu with subitems
> BUT the text for the button to click and the dropdown menu items are NOT
> showing up (and the colors are also totally wrong).
> I am fine with the "big rewrite" if you know how to change bootstrap
> code into neos compatible code BUT if neos is using bootstrap
> components, they should also WORK!
> I invested a LOT of time (really hours!) in making the broken parts work
> again but nobody cares.
> See: http://forge.typo3.org/issues/48679
> and https://review.typo3.org/21178
> my first patch was in June and half a year later nothing is going on here.
> I want to investigate in neos as i want to use it and i really love it
> BUT i dont want to waste my time.
> So please:
> - fix bootstrap code yourself or
> - let me do it or
> - provide better code!
> happy coding/fixing!

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