[Typo3-marketing] Marketing Worksshops vs Action

[Daniel Hinderink [TYPO3]]

Hi Sander,

I tried to answer in some more detail, if some parts of the subject should
be of general interest.

>> I just wrote that I understand that it does not lie with the
>> responsibilities (or possibilities) of the Association to cover the expenses
>> of such a national meeting.
> 
> I beg to differ if this is not -at least a little bit- within' the
> Associations' range of responsebillities.

Are you talking about marketing in general or funding for national meetings
in particular?

> If we like marketing to be
> part of the Communications Committée, we should at least have some
> budget otherwise we're paper tigers..

Actually none of the committees has any budget apart from administration
(mostly legal and transaction cost) and development. Isn't it still quite
possible to have a committee coordinate voluntary work?

What's more: there don't really is a working marketing/communication
committee now and may be there will never have one, if there are no
volunteers. From that perspective, it can't be "budget first", but rather
"commitment first".

However, I do see a lot of opportunities without a budget already and I
believe it will be not too hard to find one, when it's really needed.
So I will continue to hope for some strong players from the community to
join in some interesting process for devising and deploying marketing
measures.

>> Things like appearing at LinuxTag are either sponsored (Kasper was sponsored
>> by Open Source Press) or paid for by myself in my case.
> 
> That's very noble of you but I would like people like Kasper and you
> have some budget to be able to go to important events might you have the
> possibillity there to give a lecture or something about TYPO3. These
> high-press aware events *must* be covered.

That would be nice, but it simply isn't possible at present. Fortunately
there are sponsors for some events.

>> I also don't think it is a problem to go on doing it like this for the
>> foreseeable future, unless we would have to go somewhere more distant or
>> more frequent, or both.
> 
> Well that I would like you to go, US events, China Open Source
> Conference etc. (not that I want you far away ;-)

Quite frankly, the Association can neither afford the travel expenses nor
Kasper and my daily fares for doing that, even if it shelled out 100% of the
budget for marketing. By the way, we currently don't ask for our time being
paid by sponsors for such events, only expenses. Consequently, as we make a
living off other things, we can't (and don't want to) let ourselves be
entirely occupied by marketing activities.

Please remember it is voluntary work!

The bad news is, that now that the Association is here, the need for
voluntary work has not become any smaller. It also does not automatically
follow the becoming of the Association that it's Christmas every day and all
the wishes come true :-)

The good news is, that the community is full of people willing and capable
to take over parts of the tasks required voluntarily, including most of the
members of the Association.

Since this is in danger of becoming a Sander vs. Daniel discussion only:
I found Olivier's argument interesting, that marketing initiatives by the
Association would also benefit non-members. I don't agree with you on that
being a problem, but I would like to call everybody's attention to the fact,
that there are other opinions.

I would personally really like to hear more of them!

>> Obviously the Association does not have the resources at present to do most
>> of what you would like it to do and must concentrate on what is most
>> important. I also think it is more effective to look at what you are
>> proposing and try to think of how to find volunteers able and willing to
>> take over these tasks, in order to get them done.
> 
> That is possible. I agree concentrating on R&D is key. But we're bihind
> the period were we all set in our dark offices coding all night. And
> sending Michelle to an important US conference will not such an impact
> as when Kaper goes (sorry Michelle, no offense). They always want to see
> and hear 'mr. Big'.

Let's make it more practical: can you try to make a shortlist of events that
you would like TYPO3 to be represented at? Then it's easier to look at the
facts and calculate what that means in Sfr, plus it helps to target possible
sponsors.

>>> For global marketing is not much money needed and I think we should
>>> spend some Association money on it, lets say about 6% of the anual
>>> budget. Creating strong UG's and local portals for the US, South
>>> America, Australia and Asia is part of it in my view.
>> 
>> 
>> Isn't that something that should be done by people in those
>> countries/regions with help from consultancies in more mature markets?
> 
> That is what is already happening. We will give our Dutch portal to
> other regions for tailoring it to that market. But then you still need
> budget for webmarketing. We pay Google for example.

So there is an example of local players paying for it. That seems logical to
me, as they are the main beneficiaries. Would it really make more sense to
you, if this was covered by the Association?

>> As with Michelle's plans for the US portal, it also seems to me these things
>> are best done by locals.
>> 
>> What do others think about using Association funds for marketing purposes
>> such as Sander proposes?
> formation to it.
>>> 
>>> Maybe somebody can explain me what a face to face meeting can add to the
>>> ideas and knowledge we already have?
>> 
>> 
>> I would have thought there is room for improvement, but your vote is now
>> clear, thanks.
> 
> Well maybe if there is a clear agenda with points that really need to be
> worked out in theory before taken into action, it makes sense.

Yes. Ideas anyone?

> In such 
> case a German national meeting might be usefull, this I cannot judge
> 'from the outside' since I have no knowledge at all about the level of
> joint marketing out there.

It is also a very different market place, so I expect it will not work like
in the Netherlands, but I am ready for being surprised :-)

Cheers

Daniel

-- 
Vice-Chairman
TYPO3 Association
http://association.typo3.org