[TYPO3-english] worried about 4.x (6.x)

[Thomas Skierlo]

Hi François,

to make a long story short, I have much better questions than answers :-)


> Hi Thomas,
>
>> That doesn't matter. As long as community extensions are needed for
>> basic scaffolding within the CMS, they are of same importance as the
>> core itself - at least in the real world. To name a few: Url-Management,
>> News system, powerful templating. Ease of templating alway was one motor
>> of success for TYPO3, and for many integrators this part is getting
>> harder and harder with any new (sub)release. Surely I could offer
>> websites without FCE functionality. Nobody needs an accordion, it only
>> builds up barriers. I know that, you know that. But will the next client
>> know that too? Should I learn Joomla just to serve people with a need
>> for accordions? No way. Don't like the idea.
>
> You're right, but the topic is far from simple. It was discussed quite 
> a few times during Core Team meetings and we never got to an 
> agreement. What everybody agreed on was that there were some 
> extensions that provided essential features (exactly the ones you 
> name) and that would - ideally - be given special care. That's where 
> we couldn't agree. Should they be move to the Core? Should they be 
> cared for by special teams, that include Core Team members?

That's pretty easy to answer, at least, if all people involved have the 
same insight, that Content is important for an ECMS. The important part 
can be a core feature, a system extension or one from the community, as 
long as it is available at least from one, solid source. Maybe it's a 
mixture, with a new multicolumn CE in core and a demo extension, which 
shows how to use it. I know that TV is working, because it is not 
exactly using the core-way to do things - on the other hand, it does the 
job perfectly and is fast like hell. One solution might be, not to 
integrate TV into the core, but to integrate the way TV does things in 
relation to multiple sub-content elements. To break it down to more 
technical terms: There's a content object missing, which can handle a 
certain depth of subcontent. When it comes to rendering, all properties 
of parent and child objects must be available, with lazy loading being a 
luxury option.

If you watch the development of core features from 4.5 to 6.0 you might 
notice the FLUIDTEMPLATE object as a major new feature. Many of the 
other changes improve existing features without really opening new ones. 
Today be have better localization by xliff and we have a much better 
Extension Manager. This all is very good. But the need for custom 
content and multicolumn has evolved from "nice to have" to a clear "must 
have" since 4.5. We've had no real "content evolution" since 4.5

>
> The fact is that the Core Team is already very busy. I don't think it 
> would be possible to handle even more work. Furthermore, as Georg 
> says, he quite enjoys the freedom to evolve at a different rate than 
> TYPO3 releases. But I agree that it feels weird that such basic 
> features like speaking URLs and easy/easier templating are not part of 
> the Core.

I can see the problem of core team being too busy. One reason might be a 
very tight release schedule. Do we really need a new sub-release all 
three month? How many extensions will I loose after the next one? That's 
what I mean when I say: "Give peope a break to keep up, give yourself a 
break to improve things you've once started halfheartedly - to make them 
available as "solutions to problems". People must realize, that there 
will be no market anymore for a finished product TYPO3 Neos, if the vast 
majority of former users have gone mad using the last generation. It's 
good to know that Neos once will be the best system available, but 
wouldn't it be even better if this could be said about the current 
production version too? Without TV we currently have a missing feature 
of existential importance. Maybe this part of extbase needs a backport 
from upcomming Neos in means of multiple content handling?

Cheers,

Thomas