[TYPO3-english] Major background issues

[Christian Müller]

Hi Marina,

On 11.06.13 08:59, marina t wrote:
> Dear all,
> 
> I have followed with increasing desperation the exchange started by
> Jigal van Hemert a couple of days ago.

Could you point me to the exchange you mention?

> When I came across TYPO3 in my research for a usable alternative to
> WordPress, I really thought I had found what I was looking for: as a
> "Webmaster", with a lot of experience with hand-coded static Websites,
> the descriptions at <http://typo3.org/about/typo3-the-cms/> promised all
> I needed. And I loved the ethics behind the product, as well as Kasper's
> story and the general "community feel" that come through from the Website.

This community feel is there, I can assure you :)

> 
> Now, a few weeks later, after spending many hours trying to get TYPO3
> installed (please don't ask or insinuate - I have read the docs, tried
> all the scripts, tried to find all the answers online!), I discover it's
> been all for nothing. Apparently, if I wanted TYPO3 to work for me, I'd
> have to hire a specialist developer.

So you couldn't make anything you found work for you? None of the docs
helped you to get TYPO3 installed? That would be a fail of the
documentation then.

With installation you mean the act of bringing TYPO3 to run on your
server not creating a website with it, right?

Normally it is really easy and consists of copying the source+dummy
package (unpacked of course) via ftp to your server and calling the url
to the website, this will start the simple install process that will ask
you for your database credentials and allows you to setup a backend
user. That's it (true there is a more complicated install tool but for
most cases the steps I mentioned are enough).

You can also use dedicated hosters like jweiland.net, mittwald or
domainfactory who all preinstall TYPO3 for you if you like.

> 
> There's nothing wrong with the idea of paying someone else to install
> TYPO3 for me. It's just that that was not clear from the start!
> 

You really don't need to! I learned to install and use TYPO3 from
scratch all alone from internet resources. To be able to use it it took
me quite some time (and nerves) in the beginning but after I got the
basics it went quite nicely and then you see that it is a very powerful
system for bigger websites.

> So could I put forward a suggestion, or a request if you like: could
> those who have access to the Website make it clearer that TYPO3 requires
> specialist support for installation and general setup. And for this
> reason, it requires substantial money investments by "ordinary
> Webmasters" (like me) and anybody who is not a fully trained application
> programmer.

Some of the informations might look like this whole system is for
"hardcore" developers only and it is true that TYPO3 is a community of
many developers and so often has resources for them. But I can assure
you that when I started I was far from being a strong developer and I
know many in the community who use TYPO3 on a daily basis to setup and
create websites who are not the kind of developers you mention. Some
programmer background (understanding of variables and loops, if
statement) might make it easier to understand certain things but I think
you can even go without.

I know I repeat myself but I want to make it really clear that you CAN
start learning TYPO3 from scratch without being a developer and without
hiring a developer. It is just pretty difficult in the beginning.

> 
> This will enormously help those who, like me, land on TYPO3's Website
> thinking it is fundamentally as accessible and "usable" as WordPress is.

TYPO3 is considerably more complex than WordPress and I think the
community is a bit more developer oriented, both make the start way
harder than in WordPress. On the other hand TYPO3 is a tool that can be
used for much bigger projects than WordPress is usually.

> 
> Once more, I must say I am disappointed at how so-called "free software"
> ends up being a lot more expensive than "commercial" applications - both
> because of the time invested into getting nowhere, and of the ultimate
> consequence, which is the requirement of hiring a specialist for
> (possibly never ending) installation and support services. This, of
> course, not to mention the time wasted by core developers in listening
> to the moans and groans of the ignorant (would be) user base...

I repeat myself again but you cannot compare WordPress easyness with
TYPO3. Free is not the same as easy, if you take Magento (shop system)
or PSPP (statistics software) or Blender (3D Animation software) those
are all free but because their usecase is complex so is the software. It
will be hard to learn. Having said that I must add that the TYPO3
community is aware of the problem and is trying to reduce the entry barrier.

There is btw. also a new CMS in the making which tries to make the entry
easier for newcomers while trying to retain a similar level of
flexibility for the bigger projects.
http://neos.typo3.org

> 
> Thank you for reading this as a suggestion to make life easier for all!
> 
> marina

Thank you for coming back with that feedback! Most people would just
have left and not said anything.

Cheers,
Christian



-- 
Christian Mueller
TYPO3 Flow and Neos Community Contact

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