[TYPO3-dev] Moving the topic of the discussion a little bit--Based of thread "Change roadmap..."

[JoH]

>>> Smarty is _clearly_ superior to TYPO3 marker-based templating as it
>>> provides better separation of business logics and presentation.
>>> Martin gave you one very good example with looping but it doesn't
>>> end there.
>> Maybe you didn't understand the meaning of "separation" but AFAIK
>> smarty does just the contrary: It mixes up logics and presentation
>> completely, forcing the template designer to think like a programmer.
>
> Iterating items in a set just to display them is the task of
> presentation layer. And right now in Smarty you can do it in the
> template, while in TS+Markers you have to do it in your object code.

Where it belongs IMHO.
As far as I understood seperation means
Design - Logic - Storage
for current TYPO3
HTML/CSS - TypoScript/PHP - MySQL

I don't see how this can be realized with smarty.

>>> That's exactly what we are rooting for. Smarty suites my needs a lot
>>> better than TypoScript, and not because it's "standard", but because
>>> it's better. ADOdb is better than t3div_db and DBAL. Et cetera.
>> There is always something missing in your sentences: The words "for
>> me".
>
> Yep. This time I used "suites my needs". Guilty as charged ;)

You used "suites my needs because it is better" - which it is not.
It's better for you, but definitely not for me and maybe many others.

>> So why not find a way of keeping TypoScript and implementing the
>> possibility to use other templating techniques as well?
>
> For the same reasons that MS killed VB6 in favor of VB.NET - to free
> themselves of the burden of backwards compatibility that was getting
> to heavy.

It's not just about backwards compatibility. It's about keeping something
that is worth being improved.

>> Well - as far as I understood the details you described of your
>> vision of TYPO3 5.0 this sounds like a fork to me.
>
> It was meant to sound like a proposed turn in direction. And if there
> continues to be some movement in the current direction after the turn,
> then I guess it is a fork.
>
>> BTW: If all those things that make out current TYPO3 are so badly
>> written, sucking and crappy solutions: Why are you using it then?
>
> For the same reasons I still drive my rusty 1993 Ford Taurus to work -
> it's there, it still can handle 15 miles a day and it's paid for. Am I
> proclaiming by driving it that '93 Taurus is the best thing since
> sliced bread? Hell no, I take my other car when I hit the
> interstate;))

But for TYPO3 this should be different?
To stick whith your example:
The things you are proposing would be the same as if you would buy spare
parts for your new car to build them into your Taurus just to make it
possible to hit the interstate with it too.
Why not buy Formula1 engines and tune them both just to win the next Indie
500?
I guess there is a reason why there are different tools doing things in
different ways.

At the German marketing meeting somebody explained the success of TYPO3 like
this: It's not just a tool, it's a way of doing things.
I don't think we should change that completely just because there are other
ways.
There will always be other ways and other tools, other standards and other
techniques.

As I already said: I don't think TYPO3 shoudl try to be the master of all
standards.

Joey


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